Likewise, Transcriptor, the logging utility that Bigwigs relies on for logging data isn't updated either, and affects the usefulness of all submitted boss logs
We did use Transcriptor a lot to create the new Little-Wigs-Modules and it worked fine ;)
Why do you think Transcriptor isnt as useful as it could be?
As far as I am concerned, Bigwigs is an abandoned project with no commits from the authors since October/November, nor any posts from them.
That's not correct. The last two commits are from rabbit. And they are posting. Last post of funkydude was 5 days ago and his last post in the BigWigs_Naxxramas thread 1 week ago (where he requested more Transcriptor logs for all bosses).
Most of my guild has switched to DBM now. Inaccurate timers, wrong triggers, off-sync warnings, triggers that only trigger once, etc.
I'm not a high-end raider, but all bosses I go to (Sartharion and the 4 wings in Naxxramas) are working without problems in BigWigs whereas many of them don't work at all in DBM (deDE client).
While many of these have been fixed, the fixes were from... localizers. Those alphas you see... aren't official fixes, but band aids. Heck, some of the fixes don't even work.
What's not working currently? Many changes were done for the Thaddius and Sartharion modules. I can't test Thaddius but I'll test Sartharion today.
Likewise, Transcriptor, the logging utility that Bigwigs relies on for logging data isn't updated either, and affects the usefulness of all submitted boss logs.
Why does BigWigs rely on Transcriptor? It's just a different presentation of a saved combatlog so the timing of boss attacks can be analyzed easier.
And is it really a problem that Transcriptor wasn't updated a while? Is anything missing in the logs?
There is also no proper support for different difficulty modes (some bosses are different in 10/25 modes) with different spellIDs being used in each difficulty, and updates conflict each other with boss triggers not working in one mode and only in the other.
Except for Noth (where the first blink bar is shown although Noth doesn't blink in 10 men) I don't know any problems with 10/25 differences.
Which modules do you mean in particular?
Think of it like FuBar or Cartographer, Bigwigs is on life support.
I my opinion you can't compare them. FuBar wasn't updated for a long time, and these changes were only fixes for embedded libraries. In contrast, BigWigs is updated quite often. Yes, many updates are not done by the main devs and sometimes the updates don't work, but that's the advantage of Alpha packages that we have now.
As I already said, DBM isn't an option for me (deDE client) because many things are not working, timers are off and so on.
I have no problems with using Alpha packages myself, but it's a bit annoying to always remind my guild members that they shouldn't use the Curse version but instead download it directly from WowAce. And that's why I'd like to see a new Beta or Release package.
Transcriptor is more useful than combat logs as it records more (yells, chat, etc) whilst keeping it in a much more useful format, readable, and compact.
Whilst some points are true, I have not made many commits as I don't play as much, and the cold fact is I don't raid currently. BigWigs is very much and always has been very community based and i want to promote that again. I whored pretty much every commit during TBC phase and now I'm very happy that other people are making commits. Most people seem to be too afraid that I have to reasure them on IRC.
Also, I'm working on the next Trascriptor. The best way you can help is post a log, state exactly what's wrong with a module, what needs changed (time x to time Y), and why. PM is always available if you don't wish to reveal inner tactics and such as it has been in the past.
Alternatively, if there is a bug that needs fixed, you can go ahead and commit it.
Also, I'm working on the next Trascriptor. The best way you can help is post a log, state exactly what's wrong with a module, what needs changed (time x to time Y), and why. PM is always available if you don't wish to reveal inner tactics and such as it has been in the past.
I'm not sure what your plans out Funky, but some of my users have suggested that it might be nice to be able to set a boss modules to auto-enable logging when the boss module is activated. Only for modules that have the code set that it needs more logs, and of course still only if the user agrees to it.
Also, I'm not the greatest coder in the world, but I'm more than willing to help test things out for you or what not. Just let me know if you need anything. I also have a few very helpful transcriptor users that could probably help too.
The main problem was really that the last release tag was months ago, and the bulk of the users don't see any updates. Now that there is a new tag now, we'll see how it goes from here.
I might have been overly critical, but hey, we're all interested in seeing a better Bigwigs. Right now, I'm pushing Antiarc to finish up his LibDropdown library (sort of a dewdrop library but without using Ace2) which is a large step in this direction towards a possible BigWigs3.
I'm not a high-end raider, but all bosses I go to (Sartharion and the 4 wings in Naxxramas) are working without problems in BigWigs whereas many of them don't work at all in DBM (deDE client).
What has nothing to do with the language/localization (deDE), as DBM is developed by a german (speaking) person.
Anyhow, I'm quiet happy to actually read from Funkydude that BigWigs is not dead. :)
So why are nearly all localizations (especially for triggers, I don't mind if the option menu is english) missing then?
A lot of german players use the english client , i guess thats why ;)
I had a look at the files. you're right even in the 638 revision, there are a lot of triggers missing ;)
[something to do during my next raid ;) ]
I also had a look at the Bigwigs-Modules and i think the following trigger in the Malygos-Module has a typo
"Ich hatte gehofft, eure Leben schnell zu beenden doch ihr zeit euch.. hartnäckiger als erwartet.",
Looks like it should be
"Ich hatte gehofft, eure Leben schnell zu beenden doch ihr zeigt euch.. hartnäckiger als erwartet.",
Yes, I noticed that too, but since I don't raid Malygos (yet), I didn't touch it.
May also be a localization mistake from Blizzard (like "Kel´Thuzad" instead of "Kel'Thuzad" for the Patchwerk start trigger).
Someone raiding Malygos with deDE client should check it ;)
Yeah, that's right, I've fixed that and a lot more things in r4912 yesterday.
to-do: Missing triggers in the german locales
- Thaddius: polarity_trigger = "The polarity has Shifted!" [done]
- Kel'Thuzad: phase2_trigger2 = "Scream your dying breath!", phase2_trigger3 = "The end is upon you!" [done]
- Sapphiron: airphase_trigger = "%s lifts off into the air!" [done]
- Malygos: surge_trigger = "%s fixes his eyes on you!", varification for phase2_trigger and phase3_trigger [done]
I will try to get some Transcriptor files for both 10 and 25 man this or next week.
@mojosdojo
Most of your changes seem logical and ok for me, but I have a few complaints:
1. You may be correct that "in x sek" is better than "in x Sekunden", but why did you write "in xsek"? In my opinion that missing space is incorrect and awful to read.
2. In the Kel'Thuzad module for the translation start_warning you wrote "~3mins 30seks". Correct would be "~3 min 30 sek" or even better "~3:30 min". Same for the startwarn of the Loatheb and startwarn2 of the Thaddius module. "xmins" isn't correct.
3. For some modules you added a "~" for the bars whereas you removed it from some other modules. Seems a bit inconsequent for me, any reason you have done that?
4. Why did you change deathbloom_desc in the Loatheb module? There is a timer bar for that spell.
5. Why did you change the cocoon translation in the Maexxna module from "Fangnetz" to "Gespinsthülle"? That spell is called "Fangnetz". At least in the 10 men version, I don't have a Transcriptor log for the 25 men version available right now.
And just a note:
You changed "Lebenssauger" to "Lebensentzug" in the Sapphiron module and "Energieschub" to "Kraftsog" in the Thaddius module. All are correct translations, one for the 10 men version, the other for the 25 men version. So Blizzard couldn't decide how to translate it (like "Unterbrechender Schrei" and "Unterbrechungsruf" for Razuvious, which I already noted in the BigWigs_Naxxramas thread).
1. You may be correct that "in x sek" is better than "in x Sekunden", but why did you write "in xsek"? In my opinion that missing space is incorrect and awful to read.
Yeah, that's just how we've done it in the past for BC. I have come to liking it, but that's simply my preference.
2. In the Kel'Thuzad module for the translation start_warning you wrote "~3mins 30seks". Correct would be "~3 min 30 sek" or even better "~3:30 min". Same for the startwarn of the Loatheb and startwarn2 of the Thaddius module. "xmins" isn't correct.
Yes, I agree with that, ~3:30min seems to be the best, like it's done in Gothik's module.
3. For some modules you added a "~" for the bars whereas you removed it from some other modules. Seems a bit inconsequent for me, any reason you have done that?
Yes, the reason is that "~" stands for "approximately" and it's best used if a spell has a cooldown. So I tried to remove the word "cooldown" and put up a "~". But it's seems that I missed some or removed others accidentally.
5. Why did you change the cocoon translation in the Maexxna module from "Fangnetz" to "Gespinsthülle"? That spell is called "Fangnetz". At least in the 10 men version, I don't have a Transcriptor log for the 25 men version available right now.
And just a note:
You changed "Lebenssauger" to "Lebensentzug" in the Sapphiron module and "Energieschub" to "Kraftsog" in the Thaddius module. All are correct translations, one for the 10 men version, the other for the 25 men version. So Blizzard couldn't decide how to translate it (like "Unterbrechender Schrei" and "Unterbrechungsruf" for Razuvious, which I already noted in the BigWigs_Naxxramas thread).
Same problem as with Maexxna, I think we should come up with a solution to fix it once and hopefully never again ;)
Yeah, that's just how we've done it in the past for BC. I have come to liking it, but that's simply my preference.
I'm not a linguistics professor (or anything near that) but Wikipedia and all other sites I found by Goolge say that there should be a space between the number and the unit (Offtopic: Same is true for the "%" unit. Too many people aren't using a space there).
Yes, the reason is that "~" stands for "approximately" and it's best used if a spell has a cooldown. So I tried to remove the word "cooldown" and put up a "~". But it's seems that I missed some or removed others accidentally.
Ok, that's what I would expect too. But I think you mixed up some of them.
Ok.
I found another one. The Web Spray of Maexxna is also translated to "Gespinstschauer" and "Netz versprühen".
So we have 5 abilities with each two different translations only in Naxxramas now :rolleyes:
Great job Blizzard!
Btw: The "Gespinsthülle" link on the site you linked actually links to a spell named "Fangnetz". And searching Wowhead brings no results for "Gespinsthülle". Weird. And it's also interesting that none of the two Web Wrap spells show up in the abilities list of Maexxna on Wowhead.
Same problem as with Maexxna, I think we should come up with a solution to fix it once and hopefully never again ;)
Yes. I think the best would be to just add a comment in the code.
And maybe we should recheck that tranlations after each patch.
Btw: And we should definitely recheck the odd Patchwerk start trigger after each patch.
I'm not a linguistics professor (or anything near that) but Wikipedia and all other sites I found by Goolge say that there should be a space between the number and the unit.
Ok, then we should leave a space, I will now fix it in some modules, for which I have done some minor changes.
I found another one. The Web Spray of Maexxna is also translated to "Gespinstschauer" and "Netz versprühen".
So we have 5 abilities with each two different translations only in Naxxramas now :rolleyes:
Great job Blizzard!
Btw: The "Gespinsthülle" link on the site you linked actually links to a spell named "Fangnetz". And searching Wowhead brings no results for "Gespinsthülle". Weird. And it's also interesting that none of the two Web Wrap spells show up in the abilities list of Maexxna on Wowhead.
Yeah, that's weird. I will rename "Gespinsthülle" to "Fangnetz", but leave a comment. I've done the same to Sapphiron, Thaddius and Razuvious. I tend to using the ability with the shorter name because of a better readability.
Yes. I think the best would be to just add a comment in the code.
And maybe we should recheck that tranlations after each patch.
Btw: And we should definitely recheck the odd Patchwerk start trigger after each patch.
Yeah, that's right, I've fixed that and a lot more things in r4912 yesterday.
to-do: Missing triggers in the german locales
- Kel'Thuzad: phase2_trigger2 = "Scream your dying breath!", phase2_trigger3 = "The end is upon you!"
- Sapphiron: airphase_trigger = "%s lifts off into the air!"
This is for the german client. Kel tested, now proximity check works
- Kel'Thuzad:
phase2_trigger2 = "Schreiend werdet ihr diese Welt verlassen!",
phase2_trigger3 = "Euer Ende ist gekommen!",
Sapphiron not tested yet, but this is in the chatlog
- Sapphiron: airphase_trigger = "Saphiron erhebt sich in die Lüfte!"
Thanks, will commit that in the evening. Is this copied directly from a combatlog/Transcriptor log?
Seems to be ok, I guessed for "Euer Ende naht!" ;)
Saphiron doesn't work right now, but I'll fix both the airphase_trigger and the deepbreath_trigger in the evening.
Ok, we discussed that via PM: airphase_trigger has the right wording, but seems to insist on the localized boss name (which is inconsistent with enUS)! Cremor, please leave a comment in the code for this exception. And deepbreath_trigger is simply wrong :)
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Curse PremiumWe did use Transcriptor a lot to create the new Little-Wigs-Modules and it worked fine ;)
Why do you think Transcriptor isnt as useful as it could be?
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Curse PremiumThat's not correct. The last two commits are from rabbit. And they are posting. Last post of funkydude was 5 days ago and his last post in the BigWigs_Naxxramas thread 1 week ago (where he requested more Transcriptor logs for all bosses).
I'm not a high-end raider, but all bosses I go to (Sartharion and the 4 wings in Naxxramas) are working without problems in BigWigs whereas many of them don't work at all in DBM (deDE client).
What's not working currently? Many changes were done for the Thaddius and Sartharion modules. I can't test Thaddius but I'll test Sartharion today.
Why does BigWigs rely on Transcriptor? It's just a different presentation of a saved combatlog so the timing of boss attacks can be analyzed easier.
And is it really a problem that Transcriptor wasn't updated a while? Is anything missing in the logs?
Except for Noth (where the first blink bar is shown although Noth doesn't blink in 10 men) I don't know any problems with 10/25 differences.
Which modules do you mean in particular?
I my opinion you can't compare them. FuBar wasn't updated for a long time, and these changes were only fixes for embedded libraries. In contrast, BigWigs is updated quite often. Yes, many updates are not done by the main devs and sometimes the updates don't work, but that's the advantage of Alpha packages that we have now.
As I already said, DBM isn't an option for me (deDE client) because many things are not working, timers are off and so on.
I have no problems with using Alpha packages myself, but it's a bit annoying to always remind my guild members that they shouldn't use the Curse version but instead download it directly from WowAce. And that's why I'd like to see a new Beta or Release package.
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Forum ModeratorWhilst some points are true, I have not made many commits as I don't play as much, and the cold fact is I don't raid currently. BigWigs is very much and always has been very community based and i want to promote that again. I whored pretty much every commit during TBC phase and now I'm very happy that other people are making commits. Most people seem to be too afraid that I have to reasure them on IRC.
Also, I'm working on the next Trascriptor. The best way you can help is post a log, state exactly what's wrong with a module, what needs changed (time x to time Y), and why. PM is always available if you don't wish to reveal inner tactics and such as it has been in the past.
Alternatively, if there is a bug that needs fixed, you can go ahead and commit it.
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Curse PremiumThanks funkydude!
I'm not sure what your plans out Funky, but some of my users have suggested that it might be nice to be able to set a boss modules to auto-enable logging when the boss module is activated. Only for modules that have the code set that it needs more logs, and of course still only if the user agrees to it.
Also, I'm not the greatest coder in the world, but I'm more than willing to help test things out for you or what not. Just let me know if you need anything. I also have a few very helpful transcriptor users that could probably help too.
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Curse PremiumI might have been overly critical, but hey, we're all interested in seeing a better Bigwigs. Right now, I'm pushing Antiarc to finish up his LibDropdown library (sort of a dewdrop library but without using Ace2) which is a large step in this direction towards a possible BigWigs3.
What has nothing to do with the language/localization (deDE), as DBM is developed by a german (speaking) person.
Anyhow, I'm quiet happy to actually read from Funkydude that BigWigs is not dead. :)
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Curse PremiumSo why are nearly all localizations (especially for triggers, I don't mind if the option menu is english) missing then?
yep. wow, never knew that was even there. Maybe we'll have fewer people falling from the sky now.
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Curse PremiumA lot of german players use the english client , i guess thats why ;)
I had a look at the files. you're right even in the 638 revision, there are a lot of triggers missing ;)
[something to do during my next raid ;) ]
I also had a look at the Bigwigs-Modules and i think the following trigger in the Malygos-Module has a typo
Looks like it should be
Could be my broken local file though
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Curse PremiumMay also be a localization mistake from Blizzard (like "Kel´Thuzad" instead of "Kel'Thuzad" for the Patchwerk start trigger).
Someone raiding Malygos with deDE client should check it ;)
to-do: Missing triggers in the german locales
- Thaddius: polarity_trigger = "The polarity has Shifted!" [done]
- Kel'Thuzad: phase2_trigger2 = "Scream your dying breath!", phase2_trigger3 = "The end is upon you!" [done]
- Sapphiron: airphase_trigger = "%s lifts off into the air!" [done]
- Malygos: surge_trigger = "%s fixes his eyes on you!", varification for phase2_trigger and phase3_trigger [done]
I will try to get some Transcriptor files for both 10 and 25 man this or next week.
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Curse PremiumMost of your changes seem logical and ok for me, but I have a few complaints:
1. You may be correct that "in x sek" is better than "in x Sekunden", but why did you write "in xsek"? In my opinion that missing space is incorrect and awful to read.
2. In the Kel'Thuzad module for the translation start_warning you wrote "~3mins 30seks". Correct would be "~3 min 30 sek" or even better "~3:30 min". Same for the startwarn of the Loatheb and startwarn2 of the Thaddius module. "xmins" isn't correct.
3. For some modules you added a "~" for the bars whereas you removed it from some other modules. Seems a bit inconsequent for me, any reason you have done that?
4. Why did you change deathbloom_desc in the Loatheb module? There is a timer bar for that spell.
5. Why did you change the cocoon translation in the Maexxna module from "Fangnetz" to "Gespinsthülle"? That spell is called "Fangnetz". At least in the 10 men version, I don't have a Transcriptor log for the 25 men version available right now.
And just a note:
You changed "Lebenssauger" to "Lebensentzug" in the Sapphiron module and "Energieschub" to "Kraftsog" in the Thaddius module. All are correct translations, one for the 10 men version, the other for the 25 men version. So Blizzard couldn't decide how to translate it (like "Unterbrechender Schrei" and "Unterbrechungsruf" for Razuvious, which I already noted in the BigWigs_Naxxramas thread).
Yeah, that's just how we've done it in the past for BC. I have come to liking it, but that's simply my preference.
Yes, I agree with that, ~3:30min seems to be the best, like it's done in Gothik's module.
Yes, the reason is that "~" stands for "approximately" and it's best used if a spell has a cooldown. So I tried to remove the word "cooldown" and put up a "~". But it's seems that I missed some or removed others accidentally.
I will change it back.
Yeah, that's the point I think. I have done it on heroic, so that's where my logs came from. I even cross-checked it with http://www.rpguides.de/wow/solve.php?boss_id=15952&players=25, so I changed it.
Same problem as with Maexxna, I think we should come up with a solution to fix it once and hopefully never again ;)
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Curse PremiumI'm not a linguistics professor (or anything near that) but Wikipedia and all other sites I found by Goolge say that there should be a space between the number and the unit (Offtopic: Same is true for the "%" unit. Too many people aren't using a space there).
Ok, that's what I would expect too. But I think you mixed up some of them.
Ok.
I found another one. The Web Spray of Maexxna is also translated to "Gespinstschauer" and "Netz versprühen".
So we have 5 abilities with each two different translations only in Naxxramas now :rolleyes:
Great job Blizzard!
Btw: The "Gespinsthülle" link on the site you linked actually links to a spell named "Fangnetz". And searching Wowhead brings no results for "Gespinsthülle". Weird. And it's also interesting that none of the two Web Wrap spells show up in the abilities list of Maexxna on Wowhead.
Yes. I think the best would be to just add a comment in the code.
And maybe we should recheck that tranlations after each patch.
Btw: And we should definitely recheck the odd Patchwerk start trigger after each patch.
Ok, then we should leave a space, I will now fix it in some modules, for which I have done some minor changes.
Yes, possible :p
Yeah, that's weird. I will rename "Gespinsthülle" to "Fangnetz", but leave a comment. I've done the same to Sapphiron, Thaddius and Razuvious. I tend to using the ability with the shorter name because of a better readability.
Yes, we'll see :)
Btw, I will get a log for Malygos today.
This is for the german client. Kel tested, now proximity check works
- Kel'Thuzad:
phase2_trigger2 = "Schreiend werdet ihr diese Welt verlassen!",
phase2_trigger3 = "Euer Ende ist gekommen!",
Sapphiron not tested yet, but this is in the chatlog
- Sapphiron: airphase_trigger = "Saphiron erhebt sich in die Lüfte!"
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Curse PremiumThis is already in since r4924.
Thanks, will commit that in the evening. Is this copied directly from a combatlog/Transcriptor log?
Saphiron doesn't work right now, but I'll fix both the airphase_trigger and the deepbreath_trigger in the evening.
Seems to be ok, I guessed for "Euer Ende naht!" ;)
Ok, we discussed that via PM: airphase_trigger has the right wording, but seems to insist on the localized boss name (which is inconsistent with enUS)! Cremor, please leave a comment in the code for this exception. And deepbreath_trigger is simply wrong :)
I found nothing in the WoWCombatLog.txt.
But in the WoWChatLog.txt I found this text:
1/26 22:38:40.606 Kel'Thuzad schreit: Euer Ende ist gekommen!
1/26 22:38:55.905 Kel'Thuzad schlägt zu!
Sapphiron is written in German only with 1p -> "Saphiron", could this be the problem?