I actually registered just to post this. I think that it is complete BS for an author to remove a 'working' version and add a half assed version that he/she is working on. I tend to update once every couple days through WAU, and have searched far and wide for people having problems like I was having. Yes I reverted and all but givin the amount of time I spent on trying to figure out why when I UPDATED, shit broke. Yea your not getting paid and all that blah blah, but cmon people, common sense. Why fix what isn't broke?? Yea it may be broke on the PTR or whatever, but we're not playing on the PTR. Authors like this really annoy me. Do the job right or don't do it at all, and don't do it half-assed.
Don't get me wrong m8, your mod is top notch, but maybe that's why people come here a bit upset, this mod has been one of the few mods that have worked near flawless through a crapload of patches and whatnot. Some of us old timers like to keep it that way.
Sorry to be bitchy but I wasn't getting paid either for looking for the reason why a mod that I updated broke on me, and has remained that way at the place where you UPDATE your mods. Put the original WORKING version back on WAU. Seems the only logical solution to me, why should people have to search and search just to find an old release?
I actually registered just to post this. I think that it is complete BS for an author to remove a 'working' version and add a half assed version that he/she is working on. I tend to update once every couple days through WAU, and have searched far and wide for people having problems like I was having. Yes I reverted and all but givin the amount of time I spent on trying to figure out why when I UPDATED, shit broke. Yea your not getting paid and all that blah blah, but cmon people, common sense. Why fix what isn't broke?? Yea it may be broke on the PTR or whatever, but we're not playing on the PTR. Authors like this really annoy me. Do the job right or don't do it at all, and don't do it half-assed.
Don't get me wrong m8, your mod is top notch, but maybe that's why people come here a bit upset, this mod has been one of the few mods that have worked near flawless through a crapload of patches and whatnot. Some of us old timers like to keep it that way.
Sorry to be bitchy but I wasn't getting paid either for looking for the reason why a mod that I updated broke on me, and has remained that way at the place where you UPDATE your mods. Put the original WORKING version back on WAU. Seems the only logical solution to me, why should people have to search and search just to find an old release?
Simply pathetic.
Before you sling a shitload of insults to Thrae's head for doing that, I HAVE installed TinyTip, and quite frankly, while not having an ingame config, it worked fine for me. No errors whatsoever. Also, there IS a config file (lua code) provided in the TInyTip folder. And another thing, WoWAce isn't a damn release site - it's a site for beta's and alphas even, bleeding edge. And that is exactly what Thrae did with TinyTip, she or he pushed out a new version, cleaner code, full rewrite.
Your "Sorry to be bitchy but I wasn't getting paid either for looking for the reason why a mod broke" is very flawed, no one forced you to update, nor install any addons, so don't lay blame on an author for wanting to improve an addon that he/she wrote from the ground up, for fun in their own spare time.
And why fix what isn't broken? It's not because your car still runs, that it's engine is in top notch shape, or the tires. A maintenance couldn't hurt usually. And in this case, it's a new car.
Your post is, yes. If you had bothered to read the posts on the last pages, you'd have found out that TinyTip is working fine (i.e. not throwing a bunch of errors and refusing to do a thing - and I checked that with today's version, like Moon Witch). There's no config yet, big deal. Thrae's working on that.
Also, if you're not patient enough to wait for the final version, two alternatives (Cowtip and TipTac) have been pointed out in this very thread as well.
I actually registered just to post this. I think that it is complete BS .....Authors like this really annoy me. Do the job right or don't do it at all, and don't do it half-assed.
Simply pathetic.
Holy cow plops Batman! What is up with all the haters! Put the frigging mod on ignore so it won't get updated. If you don't know how to put the mod on ignore in WAU go read the wiki!
I bet Freezer64 would be right in line with the all the people who would jump on Thrae when 2.4 is released and TinyTip doesn't work. These mod writers are cursed if they do and cursed if they don't.
EDIT:Freezer64 didn't read this post before he wrote.
Since I'm not satisfied with the configuration options available right now, I'm planning on just re-releasing TinyTipOptions with its old & current Dewdrop implementation after a bit of cleanup and tweaking (one big thing -- make it a FuBar addon so it can have a minimap/FuBar icon to click). That way I can focus on more modules and more features, until WoW 2.4 comes out, which will contain new addon configuration code. Also, Ace3Config is still undergoing some development. Building options menus are a pain.
I'm sorry I can't code fast enough for you all. I will chastise myself with my own belt later on. I can't fix the old TinyTip and make a new TinyTip at the same time, and really, I was embarrassed by my own old code -- I needed to eschew it. It does not follow all the current principles and experience that I have demonstrated with the new TinyTip. Most of it I had to scrap to continue with TinyTip. Just because something appears to be working, or working for you, doesn't mean it's in good condition.
I can't make everyone happy. No one can. Since I don't code addons for fame, I cling to the nihilistic ideal of providing something beautiful and useful to you all. It's my masochistic side -- coding for fame is probably so much more rewarding to one's ego. Therefore, to code, I need to set boundaries for myself. You were all very upset at the current lack of an in-game configuration menu with the new version. I understand that, and I weighed it against my options. I decided you could all wait a week or so while I continue to improve TinyTip and set the structure needed for making a new/changing the old TinyTipOptions. I thought the users of Wowace would allow me the pleasure of mass-testing a stable version while I continued to work on the in-game options menu, among other things. This was what I expected out of this community, a community dedicated to development. I suppose my expectations were too high. We all use WAU to grab files compiled from a SVN, a development system. No one can guarantee these files to be 100% stable or include all the features you hope for -- if that were the case, there'd be no need for the SVN at all. I was simply making use of the tools available, and the community available. If you feel that is a misuse, then I say that is a better topic for an alternative thread.
As said before, there are alternatives to TinyTip. If TinyTip is not to your liking, then I suggest you take them. Some people mentioned "CowTip". TinyTip is dedicated to taking the least resources possible. CowTip was specifically designed to provide the most functionality possible, sometimes disregarding the performance hits that come with it -- hence the name Cow-Tip, a tooltip that's both big on resource usage, features, and complexity, opposite to TinyTip, a tooltip that's simple and tiny. TinyTip will never be like CowTip, as they are polar opposites in core design. TinyTip will always be simple to configure (when I get TinyTipOptions back up anyway), even while the features increase. However, what TinyTip will never do (at least on its own) is provide seemingly unlimited flexibility of something like CowTip, as one cannot increase flexibility without increasing resource usage and complexity.
Not to say there's anything wrong with that or CowTip itself, I'm just illustrating a point -- if you want something that strives for simplicity and optimal performance, get TinyTip. If you want maximum flexibility, get CowTip. If you don't like ckknight or his Rock framework, or frameworks in general, get TinyTip. If you don't like me, get CowTip. This is not me being cynical -- it's just plain logic (unless you consider logic to be cynical).
I thought the users of Wowace would allow me the pleasure of mass-testing a stable version while I continued to work on the in-game options menu, among other things. This was what I expected out of this community, a community dedicated to development. I suppose my expectations were too high. We all use WAU to grab files compiled from a SVN, a development system. No one can guarantee these files to be 100% stable or include all the features you hope for -- if that were the case, there'd be no need for the SVN at all. I was simply making use of the tools available, and the community available. If you feel that is a misuse, then I say that is a better topic for an alternative thread.
The USERS of WoWace would allow it. The crop of fanbois who just want to follow the name Ace and use the WAU are rather muddying the true community here. Ignore 'em. If they can't live with it, they shouldn't be here anyway.
[me=Jesamyn]wanders off out of this thread before she says something about immature fanboi types that'll get her banned.[/me]
I'm sorry I can't code fast enough for you all. I will chastise myself with my own belt later on. I can't fix the old TinyTip and make a new TinyTip at the same time, and really, I was embarrassed by my own old code
It's not to do with how fast you're coding at all or with fanboi's complaining....
The version before your January updates was essentially working fine on the live servers. Why didn't you just branch it, or develop it on your googlecode svn until it was: a) stable and b) feature complete.
As a developer when you look at your old code you will always feel a sense of "hey this is bad, I know so much more now, I want to refactor it". That's completely natural. If you don't look at your old code and have at least some feeling of "hey wow I can do this and this and this better" you haven't learnt anything.
It seems pointless to cripple TinyTip1 instead of just leaving it be to slowly die out and not be updated for 2.4. why not work on the new version as TinyTip2, you could have even created a TinyTip2 section in trunk if you liked and committed the changes there. Many addon's are being prepared for 2.4 and Ace3 as seperate new folders in the svn trunk or branches.
Also, this is the second time you've done this, back last year you decided to de-ace2 TinyTip. Instead of creating a new version or branching it you did the same thing your commit was semi broken and a downgrade from the previous version. Fortunately someone reverted it, perhaps it was you I don't recall.
You should NOT be embarrassed about the quality of your code in the original TinyTip, old code is old code. However, you should be embarrassed that you broke the "release" (Trunk = Release on wowace svn) version of your addon on wowace twice and downgraded it to have less features without any warning.
The positive side is that the changes caused me to go learn a bit about the GameToolTip and knock up my own version of light tooltip mod that does exactly what I want.
I actually registered just to post this. I think that it is complete BS for an author to remove a 'working' version and add a half assed version that he/she is working on. I tend to update once every couple days through WAU, and have searched far and wide for people having problems like I was having. Yes I reverted and all but givin the amount of time I spent on trying to figure out why when I UPDATED, shit broke. Yea your not getting paid and all that blah blah, but cmon people, common sense. Why fix what isn't broke?? Yea it may be broke on the PTR or whatever, but we're not playing on the PTR. Authors like this really annoy me. Do the job right or don't do it at all, and don't do it half-assed.
Don't get me wrong m8, your mod is top notch, but maybe that's why people come here a bit upset, this mod has been one of the few mods that have worked near flawless through a crapload of patches and whatnot. Some of us old timers like to keep it that way.
Sorry to be bitchy but I wasn't getting paid either for looking for the reason why a mod that I updated broke on me, and has remained that way at the place where you UPDATE your mods. Put the original WORKING version back on WAU. Seems the only logical solution to me, why should people have to search and search just to find an old release?
Simply pathetic.
You need to learn what the WoWAce SVN is, IMO.
It specifically says that this is all bleeding-edge development.
If you just update from wowace, at any given day you could update right before the raid, and your unitframes, bossmods and tooltip break because their authors are trying out new libraries in a collaborative effort.
There is a reason it's called: Beta. Or even Alpha.
Im using TipTac until the next release of TinyTip. No need to get mad at people that make mods for fun and give their time freely. Keep up the good work Thrae.
well, lurker here, or someone who doesnt post often on this boards but i have to say that it really annoyed me too.
I am neither a fanboi, or someone who has never used "open source" or generally free software that is developed via the internet and i am also using SVN at work for our inhouse projects.
Anyway, i had my fair share of trouble with finding out what is up with tinytip as well, it completely stopped working at one point and that pretty much had me spent quite some time trying to fix the problems.
Isn't there a stable tag for releasing mods that could help people like me to avoid such problems? Whenever i use Open Source software i am given the choice to download a development and a stable version, a feature that imho ACE should adapt if there has been a paradigm shift regarding to WAU or something along the lines.
I read something in the General forum about the tagging, apparently it is possible but the updaters would need to be changed to use it and the mod-authors would need to start using the tags ofc?
Pop that in a RSS reader - that feed will give you the changelogs. It saves time and frustration - Major possibly breaking change? Read it here before you update!
I read something in the General forum about the tagging, apparently it is possible but the updaters would need to be changed to use it and the mod-authors would need to start using the tags ofc?
So now that different ppl tell different things, I had a lookup for those definitions.
First, WAU is for updating BETA level software with all its limitations. That is perfectly OK with me.
So, what is beta level software? "Beta level software generally includes all features, but may also include known issues and bugs of a less serious variety." I cited from wikipedia(enEn).
After looking on TinyTip (available for WAU), it, if it claims to be beta, doesn't have all features included. If not to say, in comparation to the 1.4 version, mostly none of the known features. This is, referring to the author, not the final intention, for he will include the known features as modules.
But, beta level software GENERALLY includes all features, there is no rule not to claim TinyTip beta with most features we were used to in 1.4 missing :) But for public testing purposes it has to be claimed beta.
For me and in my own opinion, especially comparing TinyTip "Two" with TinyTip "One", I still would have stated it alpha level and I am not happy with the replacement of the old TinyTip on WAU, I would have upped it as TinyTip2/TinyTip Improved/TinyTip Gold. But I am not Thrae and he can do what he likes with his software.
And for those ppl out there who flame and blame on Thrae, what is the deal? Tell him what you are missing, dont tell him what you think of him or his software. Because the one thing which doesn't work for sure, you found it :)
Thrae wants to have feedback on his addon, therefore its beta level status, therefore its presentation on WAU. If you will not help him, sit down and search for alternatives to TinyTip.
It's not like it took you that long to fix the problem. Really it should have taken you the same amount of time as bitching and complaining on the forums.
Anyway, great work Thrae the new version is shaping up to be a rice nice addon.
I frequently see references to how "TinyTip1" will break in patch 2.4, yet I've been using it on the 2.4 PTR for weeks now, and it works perfectly fine. What exactly is breaking in 2.4 with the original TinyTip?
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http://www.wowace.com/wiki/CowTip
I picked it as a temporary replacement when TinyTip initially broke, and after playing with it for a few days I won't be going back.
Edit: All of it seems to be broken now.
Don't get me wrong m8, your mod is top notch, but maybe that's why people come here a bit upset, this mod has been one of the few mods that have worked near flawless through a crapload of patches and whatnot. Some of us old timers like to keep it that way.
Sorry to be bitchy but I wasn't getting paid either for looking for the reason why a mod that I updated broke on me, and has remained that way at the place where you UPDATE your mods. Put the original WORKING version back on WAU. Seems the only logical solution to me, why should people have to search and search just to find an old release?
Simply pathetic.
Before you sling a shitload of insults to Thrae's head for doing that, I HAVE installed TinyTip, and quite frankly, while not having an ingame config, it worked fine for me. No errors whatsoever. Also, there IS a config file (lua code) provided in the TInyTip folder. And another thing, WoWAce isn't a damn release site - it's a site for beta's and alphas even, bleeding edge. And that is exactly what Thrae did with TinyTip, she or he pushed out a new version, cleaner code, full rewrite.
Your "Sorry to be bitchy but I wasn't getting paid either for looking for the reason why a mod broke" is very flawed, no one forced you to update, nor install any addons, so don't lay blame on an author for wanting to improve an addon that he/she wrote from the ground up, for fun in their own spare time.
And why fix what isn't broken? It's not because your car still runs, that it's engine is in top notch shape, or the tires. A maintenance couldn't hurt usually. And in this case, it's a new car.
Your post is, yes. If you had bothered to read the posts on the last pages, you'd have found out that TinyTip is working fine (i.e. not throwing a bunch of errors and refusing to do a thing - and I checked that with today's version, like Moon Witch). There's no config yet, big deal. Thrae's working on that.
Also, if you're not patient enough to wait for the final version, two alternatives (Cowtip and TipTac) have been pointed out in this very thread as well.
Holy cow plops Batman! What is up with all the haters! Put the frigging mod on ignore so it won't get updated. If you don't know how to put the mod on ignore in WAU go read the wiki!
I bet Freezer64 would be right in line with the all the people who would jump on Thrae when 2.4 is released and TinyTip doesn't work. These mod writers are cursed if they do and cursed if they don't.
EDIT:Freezer64 didn't read this post before he wrote.
I'm sorry I can't code fast enough for you all. I will chastise myself with my own belt later on. I can't fix the old TinyTip and make a new TinyTip at the same time, and really, I was embarrassed by my own old code -- I needed to eschew it. It does not follow all the current principles and experience that I have demonstrated with the new TinyTip. Most of it I had to scrap to continue with TinyTip. Just because something appears to be working, or working for you, doesn't mean it's in good condition.
I can't make everyone happy. No one can. Since I don't code addons for fame, I cling to the nihilistic ideal of providing something beautiful and useful to you all. It's my masochistic side -- coding for fame is probably so much more rewarding to one's ego. Therefore, to code, I need to set boundaries for myself. You were all very upset at the current lack of an in-game configuration menu with the new version. I understand that, and I weighed it against my options. I decided you could all wait a week or so while I continue to improve TinyTip and set the structure needed for making a new/changing the old TinyTipOptions. I thought the users of Wowace would allow me the pleasure of mass-testing a stable version while I continued to work on the in-game options menu, among other things. This was what I expected out of this community, a community dedicated to development. I suppose my expectations were too high. We all use WAU to grab files compiled from a SVN, a development system. No one can guarantee these files to be 100% stable or include all the features you hope for -- if that were the case, there'd be no need for the SVN at all. I was simply making use of the tools available, and the community available. If you feel that is a misuse, then I say that is a better topic for an alternative thread.
As said before, there are alternatives to TinyTip. If TinyTip is not to your liking, then I suggest you take them. Some people mentioned "CowTip". TinyTip is dedicated to taking the least resources possible. CowTip was specifically designed to provide the most functionality possible, sometimes disregarding the performance hits that come with it -- hence the name Cow-Tip, a tooltip that's both big on resource usage, features, and complexity, opposite to TinyTip, a tooltip that's simple and tiny. TinyTip will never be like CowTip, as they are polar opposites in core design. TinyTip will always be simple to configure (when I get TinyTipOptions back up anyway), even while the features increase. However, what TinyTip will never do (at least on its own) is provide seemingly unlimited flexibility of something like CowTip, as one cannot increase flexibility without increasing resource usage and complexity.
Not to say there's anything wrong with that or CowTip itself, I'm just illustrating a point -- if you want something that strives for simplicity and optimal performance, get TinyTip. If you want maximum flexibility, get CowTip. If you don't like ckknight or his Rock framework, or frameworks in general, get TinyTip. If you don't like me, get CowTip. This is not me being cynical -- it's just plain logic (unless you consider logic to be cynical).
Thanks for your time. Back to work.
The USERS of WoWace would allow it. The crop of fanbois who just want to follow the name Ace and use the WAU are rather muddying the true community here. Ignore 'em. If they can't live with it, they shouldn't be here anyway.
[me=Jesamyn]wanders off out of this thread before she says something about immature fanboi types that'll get her banned.[/me]
It's not to do with how fast you're coding at all or with fanboi's complaining....
The version before your January updates was essentially working fine on the live servers. Why didn't you just branch it, or develop it on your googlecode svn until it was: a) stable and b) feature complete.
As a developer when you look at your old code you will always feel a sense of "hey this is bad, I know so much more now, I want to refactor it". That's completely natural. If you don't look at your old code and have at least some feeling of "hey wow I can do this and this and this better" you haven't learnt anything.
It seems pointless to cripple TinyTip1 instead of just leaving it be to slowly die out and not be updated for 2.4. why not work on the new version as TinyTip2, you could have even created a TinyTip2 section in trunk if you liked and committed the changes there. Many addon's are being prepared for 2.4 and Ace3 as seperate new folders in the svn trunk or branches.
Also, this is the second time you've done this, back last year you decided to de-ace2 TinyTip. Instead of creating a new version or branching it you did the same thing your commit was semi broken and a downgrade from the previous version. Fortunately someone reverted it, perhaps it was you I don't recall.
You should NOT be embarrassed about the quality of your code in the original TinyTip, old code is old code. However, you should be embarrassed that you broke the "release" (Trunk = Release on wowace svn) version of your addon on wowace twice and downgraded it to have less features without any warning.
The positive side is that the changes caused me to go learn a bit about the GameToolTip and knock up my own version of light tooltip mod that does exactly what I want.
So it wasn't all bad I guess.
You need to learn what the WoWAce SVN is, IMO.
It specifically says that this is all bleeding-edge development.
If you just update from wowace, at any given day you could update right before the raid, and your unitframes, bossmods and tooltip break because their authors are trying out new libraries in a collaborative effort.
There is a reason it's called: Beta. Or even Alpha.
*sigh*
I am neither a fanboi, or someone who has never used "open source" or generally free software that is developed via the internet and i am also using SVN at work for our inhouse projects.
Anyway, i had my fair share of trouble with finding out what is up with tinytip as well, it completely stopped working at one point and that pretty much had me spent quite some time trying to fix the problems.
Isn't there a stable tag for releasing mods that could help people like me to avoid such problems? Whenever i use Open Source software i am given the choice to download a development and a stable version, a feature that imho ACE should adapt if there has been a paradigm shift regarding to WAU or something along the lines.
Pop that in a RSS reader - that feed will give you the changelogs. It saves time and frustration - Major possibly breaking change? Read it here before you update!
http://svn.wowace.com/wowace/tags/TinyTip/1.4.12/
http://svn.wowace.com/wowace/tags/TinyTipExtras/1.4.12/
http://svn.wowace.com/wowace/tags/TinyTipOptions/1.4.12/
http://svn.wowace.com/wowace/tags/TipLib/
Note: svn.wowace.com is a mirror and may not be updated yet for the tags.
First, WAU is for updating BETA level software with all its limitations. That is perfectly OK with me.
So, what is beta level software? "Beta level software generally includes all features, but may also include known issues and bugs of a less serious variety." I cited from wikipedia(enEn).
After looking on TinyTip (available for WAU), it, if it claims to be beta, doesn't have all features included. If not to say, in comparation to the 1.4 version, mostly none of the known features. This is, referring to the author, not the final intention, for he will include the known features as modules.
But, beta level software GENERALLY includes all features, there is no rule not to claim TinyTip beta with most features we were used to in 1.4 missing :) But for public testing purposes it has to be claimed beta.
For me and in my own opinion, especially comparing TinyTip "Two" with TinyTip "One", I still would have stated it alpha level and I am not happy with the replacement of the old TinyTip on WAU, I would have upped it as TinyTip2/TinyTip Improved/TinyTip Gold. But I am not Thrae and he can do what he likes with his software.
And for those ppl out there who flame and blame on Thrae, what is the deal? Tell him what you are missing, dont tell him what you think of him or his software. Because the one thing which doesn't work for sure, you found it :)
Thrae wants to have feedback on his addon, therefore its beta level status, therefore its presentation on WAU. If you will not help him, sit down and search for alternatives to TinyTip.
Anyway, great work Thrae the new version is shaping up to be a rice nice addon.
Thanks. Gonna give CowTip a try now. Loved TinyTip, hope this is a suitable replacement.