I think they could easily implement more than just two specs, and I think they might at least eventually (probably not right away). Maybe add them in like bank slots/gbank tabs with the more slots you have the more you pay. I think this will be an important feature that raiders as well as pvpers will need to evaluate and submit good feedback on. Now we get to wait for the PTR and other blue notes.
I disagree with this. There are a number of quests that end in instances, and the instances contain lore that players might want to see. Not doing any instances prior to 68 is generally a bad idea because party play is an integral part of WoW.
i agree. i'm not sure blizzard really wants people to rush to 80, then do all the game content -- even tho, really, it kind of seems like they do at times.
It's kind of offtopic, but while leveling except for some instances like SM (which twinks seem to run) it's literally impossible to get 5 people to go.
I play lots of alts and I can tell you that in some zones while leveling you are literally alone there. Even if your /who does show 5 people in appropriate level range, the chance that all of them actually want to go to the instance when you can is really low.
The only runs I see happening in some sort of stable fashion are from guilds who level alts in sync and then do guild runs. I think a fresh player would be hard pressed to experience leveling instance anywhere to the way most of us who started playing within a year of launch.
That's really a function of population density and effort required to form groups, and I don't see dual spec really making a big dent there should it be available. If it is available but costs even a fraction 5k gold it won't be that great for fresh players either.
On dual spec for instances while leveling. Really at least in WotLK there is no leveling instance that requires main specs. In fact I wouldn't be afraid to have a pet or mail wearer tank and have a caster off-spec heal (moonkin, elemental shaman, shadow priest). It works fine. Leveling instances before were less like that but those suffer from population count starvation mostly...
I do think dual spec would be nice for pvp vs pve even when leveling but I do think it does have most of it's impact at level cap where there are many roles to fill and a large pool of people looking to fo group content that require specific roles. In fact an argument can be made that pure DPS classes have it best because with a pvp and a pve spec they basically cover all content. A raid healer/tank may want a solo pve/raid dps and a pvp spec and will have to choose.
i agree. i'm not sure blizzard really wants people to rush to 80, then do all the game content -- even tho, really, it kind of seems like they do at times.
I don't know about that... see DKs starting at 55, and they've said before they're aware that the higher the level cap becomes, the more of a grind it is to level an alt.
I wouldn't be surprised if one day we're allowed to start alts at higher than lvl 1 provided we meet certain conditions, such as having 1 or more toons at max level.
It's funny in a way. While they need to keep releasing content for high-lvl players, it essentially renders older content obsolete. I never understood why in BC, there were no pre-requisites from the old world. Such as must have done certain quests chains or visited certain old-world instances in order to, say, open up Auchindoun instances. Then came LK, and they did it again. There are no ties to anything that happened before. *Shrug*
As a ret pally, in ret gear, I was able to (bearly) heal DTK with an 80 tank in ~naxx10 gear and 2 80 DPS's (which did about on par with our 75 DPS, pathetic eh?). Had the whole group been my level, I wouldn't have been able to heal in that gear, and I don't know if my green quest reward healy set would have given me enough mana and +heal to have healed it.
For example a druid could have a bear, a cat and a tree spec too ;) (my main is a druid, and I don't know what will be my two selection; I want a pure tanking spec, but I don't want to give up my dps kitty talents...)
Yeah and I want a PvE spec (well .. 2) and 2 PvP specs ... :)
They have to draw a line, and 2 specs is fine imo. Tho I seriously hope it will be available before 80 (at lvl 70 or so) and that it doesnt cost like .. a few 1000's of gold.
I don't think they will make it cost 5000g... Actually there were no blue post yet that names a number. I guess it will be something about 500g to 1000g.
They don't want it to be a premium feature that casuals can't access easily.
I would imagine that if they add more then 2 specs that additional specs would be really expensive.
I don't think they will make it cost 5000g... Actually there were no blue post yet that names a number. I guess it will be something about 500g to 1000g.
They don't want it to be a premium feature that casuals can't access easily.
I would imagine that if they add more then 2 specs that additional specs would be really expensive.
Agreed 5k gold would be too pricey to include casual people (like me) who spot heal but spend most of there time in a DPS build farming.
As a ret pally, in ret gear, I was able to (bearly) heal DTK with an 80 tank in ~naxx10 gear and 2 80 DPS's (which did about on par with our 75 DPS, pathetic eh?). Had the whole group been my level, I wouldn't have been able to heal in that gear, and I don't know if my green quest reward healy set would have given me enough mana and +heal to have healed it.
Gear makes a huge difference. My ret pala is currently 75 and has +4 int and +0 sp on his gear. If I collected caster gear I'd have more than twice the mana pool, easily +1000sp plus other side goodies, such as mp5 and haste. That's massively different.
Yeah a dps specced hybrid healer in physical DPS kit is kinda much, but that wasn't really what I was referring to.
As a hybrid class, two is just the beginning... and very basic at that. My main is a priest and I run shadow. If I were to go heal, depending upon the fight deep holy is good, or on some disc is better (just PvE). That right there is three specs and doesn't even think of a slot for pvp. Now, if I were being cheap, I could probably settle on two or three. But if I had the option to buy more I would.
I don't think they will make it cost 5000g... Actually there were no blue post yet that names a number. I guess it will be something about 500g to 1000g.
They don't want it to be a premium feature that casuals can't access easily.
I would imagine that if they add more then 2 specs that additional specs would be really expensive.
Casuals can easily access hundreds of gold a day, it's not hard via dailies, not even stepping foot into a dungeon. In fact it's the casuals that buy up the BOE epics from Naxx and other dungeons at premium prices too ;D. They can afford a 500-1000g base (they did it to fly).
It's kind of offtopic, but while leveling except for some instances like SM (which twinks seem to run) it's literally impossible to get 5 people to go.
i dunno. i think if people could spec a solo vs group spec, you might find more people willing to group up. right now, if you've specialized to be a healer, you're gonna have a tough time grinding by yourself so there's a built-in disincentive to spec a healer unless you're the designated healer for a guild.
I'm not saying it's not nice, but I do believe that it will hardly help because sheer numbers are the problem at least on my, fairly full, server. If you got too few people who want to go an instance - whether they are dual specced or single specced doesn't matter really.
I don't know about that... see DKs starting at 55, and they've said before they're aware that the higher the level cap becomes, the more of a grind it is to level an alt.
I wouldn't be surprised if one day we're allowed to start alts at higher than lvl 1 provided we meet certain conditions, such as having 1 or more toons at max level.
It's funny in a way. While they need to keep releasing content for high-lvl players, it essentially renders older content obsolete. I never understood why in BC, there were no pre-requisites from the old world. Such as must have done certain quests chains or visited certain old-world instances in order to, say, open up Auchindoun instances. Then came LK, and they did it again. There are no ties to anything that happened before. *Shrug*
yeah, i don't quite get what they're trying to do exactly. a big gripe i have with wow is that they seem to want you to rush to level 80 as tho the leveling process isn't actually a game worth playing and rather a chore you must endure to earn your cookies. if the level grind is boring, the solution is to inject more fun into it not to create ways to skip it, imo.
I'm not saying it's not nice, but I do believe that it will hardly help because sheer numbers are the problem at least on my, fairly full, server. If you got too few people who want to go an instance - whether they are dual specced or single specced doesn't matter really.
sure. i'm not saying it would solve that particular problem, but i think it certainly could help it. theoretical, tho i suppose.
I think the implementation of dual spec you are likely to see when the PTR goes live is going to have some substantial differences from the initial announcement. We tend to iterate a great deal, which is one of the reasons we don't do big announcements more often.
tbh, it is the failing casuals that gripe with out cause or reason that joined the game in BC, that is runing it. Classic WoW was hard, and just took for ever for things... remember trying to get your T2 pants off of Rag... >.>
Casuals have destroyed this game,
They don't want to grind to level == DK @ 55...
They don't want to raid to get epics == badges / pvp, easy street
They don't want to understand that spec == game, thus dual specs..
Dual spec will hurt the game. Your spec is your game, it is what you do. Everything is / was designed around it. Your spec defines who your char is, you know your place.
If you don't know where your place is, those players tend to suck..
Just IMO
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Curse Premium??? Who would need more than two? And why???
i agree. i'm not sure blizzard really wants people to rush to 80, then do all the game content -- even tho, really, it kind of seems like they do at times.
I play lots of alts and I can tell you that in some zones while leveling you are literally alone there. Even if your /who does show 5 people in appropriate level range, the chance that all of them actually want to go to the instance when you can is really low.
The only runs I see happening in some sort of stable fashion are from guilds who level alts in sync and then do guild runs. I think a fresh player would be hard pressed to experience leveling instance anywhere to the way most of us who started playing within a year of launch.
That's really a function of population density and effort required to form groups, and I don't see dual spec really making a big dent there should it be available. If it is available but costs even a fraction 5k gold it won't be that great for fresh players either.
On dual spec for instances while leveling. Really at least in WotLK there is no leveling instance that requires main specs. In fact I wouldn't be afraid to have a pet or mail wearer tank and have a caster off-spec heal (moonkin, elemental shaman, shadow priest). It works fine. Leveling instances before were less like that but those suffer from population count starvation mostly...
I do think dual spec would be nice for pvp vs pve even when leveling but I do think it does have most of it's impact at level cap where there are many roles to fill and a large pool of people looking to fo group content that require specific roles. In fact an argument can be made that pure DPS classes have it best because with a pvp and a pve spec they basically cover all content. A raid healer/tank may want a solo pve/raid dps and a pvp spec and will have to choose.
I don't know about that... see DKs starting at 55, and they've said before they're aware that the higher the level cap becomes, the more of a grind it is to level an alt.
I wouldn't be surprised if one day we're allowed to start alts at higher than lvl 1 provided we meet certain conditions, such as having 1 or more toons at max level.
It's funny in a way. While they need to keep releasing content for high-lvl players, it essentially renders older content obsolete. I never understood why in BC, there were no pre-requisites from the old world. Such as must have done certain quests chains or visited certain old-world instances in order to, say, open up Auchindoun instances. Then came LK, and they did it again. There are no ties to anything that happened before. *Shrug*
For example a druid could have a bear, a cat and a tree spec too ;) (my main is a druid, and I don't know what will be my two selection; I want a pure tanking spec, but I don't want to give up my dps kitty talents...)
They have to draw a line, and 2 specs is fine imo. Tho I seriously hope it will be available before 80 (at lvl 70 or so) and that it doesnt cost like .. a few 1000's of gold.
They don't want it to be a premium feature that casuals can't access easily.
I would imagine that if they add more then 2 specs that additional specs would be really expensive.
I'd like three. I'm currenty playing a Moonkin... I'd like an additional healing and feral spec.. I have gear for everything by now ;)
Agreed 5k gold would be too pricey to include casual people (like me) who spot heal but spend most of there time in a DPS build farming.
Gear makes a huge difference. My ret pala is currently 75 and has +4 int and +0 sp on his gear. If I collected caster gear I'd have more than twice the mana pool, easily +1000sp plus other side goodies, such as mp5 and haste. That's massively different.
Yeah a dps specced hybrid healer in physical DPS kit is kinda much, but that wasn't really what I was referring to.
As a hybrid class, two is just the beginning... and very basic at that. My main is a priest and I run shadow. If I were to go heal, depending upon the fight deep holy is good, or on some disc is better (just PvE). That right there is three specs and doesn't even think of a slot for pvp. Now, if I were being cheap, I could probably settle on two or three. But if I had the option to buy more I would.
Casuals can easily access hundreds of gold a day, it's not hard via dailies, not even stepping foot into a dungeon. In fact it's the casuals that buy up the BOE epics from Naxx and other dungeons at premium prices too ;D. They can afford a 500-1000g base (they did it to fly).
i dunno. i think if people could spec a solo vs group spec, you might find more people willing to group up. right now, if you've specialized to be a healer, you're gonna have a tough time grinding by yourself so there's a built-in disincentive to spec a healer unless you're the designated healer for a guild.
yeah, i don't quite get what they're trying to do exactly. a big gripe i have with wow is that they seem to want you to rush to level 80 as tho the leveling process isn't actually a game worth playing and rather a chore you must endure to earn your cookies. if the level grind is boring, the solution is to inject more fun into it not to create ways to skip it, imo.
sure. i'm not saying it would solve that particular problem, but i think it certainly could help it. theoretical, tho i suppose.
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Curse Premiumtbh, it is the failing casuals that gripe with out cause or reason that joined the game in BC, that is runing it. Classic WoW was hard, and just took for ever for things... remember trying to get your T2 pants off of Rag... >.>
Casuals have destroyed this game,
They don't want to grind to level == DK @ 55...
They don't want to raid to get epics == badges / pvp, easy street
They don't want to understand that spec == game, thus dual specs..
Dual spec will hurt the game. Your spec is your game, it is what you do. Everything is / was designed around it. Your spec defines who your char is, you know your place.
If you don't know where your place is, those players tend to suck..
Just IMO